Shooting for Stars & Solving Problems with Lizz Behler

Lizz Behler: Pulling social into everything. When I say "social," and I'm kind of laughing at myself because I can't even imagine how many times I've said this in the last couple of years is, social is not just a platform, it's a behavior. And that's why these channels exist, and it's something that Big Spaceship, SPCSHP has done really, really well. And so really wanted to like tap into that. How do we position that as, you know, what we do as part of our core offering?

Chris Hill: Welcome to We Built This Brand, the podcast where we talk to the creators and collaborators behind brands, and provide you with practical insights that you can use in growing your own business. Today we're talking with Lizz Behler, Senior Vice President Brand Offerings at SPCSHP, an independent agency of creative specialists, exploring new ways to engage and connect with people today.

Now Lizz was hired at SPCSHP to help them rebrand their company, and so she has a very unique position on marketing and branding for them. Lizz was a lot of fun to speak with too, and we discussed everything from the importance of branding your company to what it means to be a creative problem solver.

If you like books, spaceships, or the challenges of marketing and branding, I think you'll really get a lot out of this conversation. That said, here's my conversation with Lizz Behler of SPCSHP.

Alright, Lizz, welcome to We Built This Brand.

Lizz Behler: Thanks Chris. Happy to be here.

Chris Hill: Absolutely. it's great to have you, and I am excited to talk to you today about what you do at SPCSHP and just some of the more fun stuff around creative problem solving. So, let's just dive in.

I always like to start with learning where you got your start and how you got to SPCSHP, and of course, I'm gonna have to ask what SPCSHP is, 'cause some people are gonna be like, what are you talking about? So.

Lizz Behler: Well, how far back you wanna go?

Chris Hill: Oh man. Just your professional journey is fine. Not childhood or anything.

Lizz Behler: Yeah. Well that's good. We'll keep, yeah. So I actually came up through the creative track before I went into strategies.

It's now College for Creative Studies. I want to call it Center for Creative Studies, but that's it was when I was there, immediately went into marketing and advertising. And I loved being in creative. I was there for about the first six, seven years, and at about that mark I started to find that I was doing more research, and I just loved the study of people of culture. It just to fuel my creativity, and I had an opportunity to apply for a job in strategy, and so I made the switch and never looked back.

So I've had the privilege to work at a lot of different agencies and the past, I wanna say about 12 years, I've worked almost exclusively for New York agencies, which is kind of interesting given I'm in Detroit. But, I find there's so much energy and talent there that it's, you know, privilege to get to work with them.

So for the past two years, I've been at SPCSHP, and SPCSHP, formerly known as Big Spaceship. I joined in order to rebrand reposition the agency. So it was a really interesting time for the company and, you know, was tapped and met with the few people internally, and it seemed like an amazing challenge and opportunity. So I joined.

Chris Hill: That's really neat.

So, that works, that ties in really well. 'cause I was really curious about the name SPCSHP, and I saw Big Spaceship as well, and I was wondering how that all changed. So you, you had a front row seat to that. So let's dive into that a little bit.

Tell me about that challenge, because that's a big challenge to come in and be the first thing you work on too.

Lizz Behler: Well, and you know, honestly that is why I joined though, is like, what a cool thing to join a company to do what we do for so many clients, you know, brand strategy, brand positioning, all the identity systems, and joining SPCSHP again at the time, Big Spaceship, the ask was to support that shift. What do we need to be in today's market? And yeah, the intention coming in was not, oh, well you definitely need to change the name. That was not where things started, but it was a 10 month journey very closely with our founder, Michael Lebowitz, and a lot of the creative crew in house.

And what I found was all this amazing through lines. Like, that was kind of where I wanted to start is what do we already have? What do we do really, really well and what are the things that are maybe getting in the way of that? And you know when they started to peel back those layers, as you know, again, as you would do for any brand, I started to find this amazing cultural thread, like Big Spaceship started developing websites, but they weren't just websites, like transactional. They were really immersive experiences. They were about bringing people together, which is something from a web experience standpoint is pretty unusual given, you know, we were founded in 2000, right? And so websites then were pretty transactional, like basic blocking tackling. So that was a really amazing starting point to see for an agency, and then more recently, pulling social into everything. When I, when I say social and I'm kind of laughing at myself because I can't even imagine how many times I've said this in the past couple of years, is social, not just a platform, it's a behavior. And that's why these channels exist, and it's something that Big Spaceship, SPCSHP has done really, really well, and so really wanted to like tap into that.

How do we position that as, you know, what we do as part of our core offering? And I know you're gonna ask me this, you know, SPCSHP with no vowels, like. Why the no vowels? I mean.

Chris Hill: I literally had that question written down.

Lizz Behler: A lot of people do. It's funny, like I said, the intention was not to change the name, but as you peel back the layers and wanted to get to simplicity of what we are, we ended up coming to SPCSHP because the kind of core DNA is about curiosity, that exploration, experimentation, and so when you think of a spaceship and, you know, I used to have this plastered on my walls, there's that kind of unbridled curiosity. You're immersing yourself in a solar system, a planet, whatever it is to understand what's there, and it's that type of mindset that we want embody.

I remember the conversation with Michael about the name SPCSHP, and he goes, I can pull up the note that I have from 2000, or you know, pre-2000. I wanted to call the agency SPCSHP, but someone else had taken the name at the time. And I was like, well that's interesting because as we talk about what we're trying to create, it's not just about one big SPCSHP, it's about how we work with other entities.

And so that was platform for why we changed to SPCSHP. Now the vowels were really focused on adaptability and speed, and even without the vowels, you can still read it as SPCSHP. And so that was why it was intentionally done of how much do you actually need in today's world, what cues from a verbal standpoint or from a visual standpoint, do you need in order to come to our name, so that's why the vowels aren't there. You know, we we're a little bit more clever than that, but it was really that experiment with today's culture and the nomenclature of today.

Chris Hill: Oh yeah, that makes total sense, and I like that there's a story behind it that goes into the brand itself. Like, just randomly saying, "I want it to be named SPCSHP." Cool, but now you have meaning behind the name other than just having it be the name. And was there another meaning behind SPCSHP?

Like did the founder have a reason he wanted to call it SPCSHP when he started, or did he just think that was a cool name?

Lizz Behler: Think about when you're a kid and just those moments of awe, right? And a spaceship is something as a kid, I mean, wow, that seems so limitless, so powerful. Like the adventures you could go on, the level of creative mind that that unleashes.

And so that was very much part of it. And, you know, when Michael founded the company, that was definitely the spirit that he brought to the table. He still does today and so does our crew. So it still fits.

Chris Hill: That's awesome. That's really cool. I can think of a lot of things in my life regarding like space travel and things like that, that, yeah, it's inspiring. It's fun.

It's, you know, something I've always been interested in. So I can see how that makes a lot of sense, and when you're talking about doing unique websites, like you talked about one-offs and things like that, that, to me, makes, yeah, like SPCSHP sounds like the type of company that would make that, if that makes sense.

So that, that's very, very neat.

So, what is your approach to working with brands like?

Lizz Behler: Ooh. It's my favorite thing. I always start with stakeholder interviews. It sounds so silly, so basic, but really talking to people to understand the unique perspectives that you have internally, and you know, I often start with just the basic questions of, "Why'd you join? Why are you here?" regardless of the brand. You joined for a reason. What was it? And now that you are here, what are the things that you think are. Most interesting, most valuable. I often like to ask the question of, what's that thing that you know about the brand or company that maybe other people would find surprising or don't know?

But I find that so many of the positionings that I've come to regardless of brand, have been through those interviews. It's, you really want make sure that it's something that exists. It's authentic, that you're not trying to manufacture something for a company or brand unless you're starting from scratch. You're like, "What are we gonna be?" But when you join a company, It has to feel on brand, you know, when you're repositioning, when you're trying to simplify things or move to a, you know, a different set of offerings. And so starting with those interviews and then even before I joined SPCSHP, I went through kind of the book of work. You know, "What type of creative output?" "How are we communicating out in the world?"

"What type of clients?" And particularly with SPCSHP, it was what type of clients do we work with now, but also what are areas that we're curious about that we wanna explore and expand into? And in what way? And so the unique thing with SPCSHP is it wasn't just rebranding and positioning, it was also going, what are we gonna offer?

There are so many agencies out there as a very, very crowded space. What do we do that is, you know, unique to us? I say unique to us and It's difficult to say that because there's so many adjacencies and overlap, but still like, what do we wanna do with our superpower and the strength that we wanna continue to fortify and build?

And so that was also very much part of it. And again, it came from those interviews, those conversations.

Chris Hill: Yeah, I call that getting fingertip close to the customer. Actually being able to put your hand on the product, being able to be there with the, the client and stuff. I remember the first time I ever did that years ago in marketing, and it made such a huge impact on the project we were working on because we had been there, we understood their needs, we understood their challenges, and yeah, it's just one of those things that I think is way undervalued a lot of times. So I'm glad to hear you say that. 'cause it does matter to hear from the, as you said, stakeholders within the organization and even outside the organization that are, you know, consumers and whatnot to understand their needs and desires for the products. So, that's great. That's a great starting place, and so you have that.

I also noticed your tagline is, you know, making meaningful connections through empathy and clarity. So how does empathy play into things? I'm very curious.

Lizz Behler: Well, you have to start with that deep understanding of people, right?

I think that understanding situations people are in, you know, whether that's a consumer, a brand, a business that you're working with, kind of that whole chain if you will, is really, really important in how we create stories. You know, on behalf of the brands that we work with. I mean, everything is a storytelling vessel, right?

Whether it's a product or a social media post, but you have to have that understanding off the people that you're trying to connect with in order to make that something valuable. And that takes work, and it also, much like the interviews, it takes really active, intentional listening and research. So that's kind of core to what we do.

Chris Hill: Yeah. That's great. That's great.

So as you've built the brand, how have you seen, since you spent that time helping kind of rebuild, rebrand, all of that, how has that affected the company as a whole? Because obviously with what you all do, you're not just doing that task of rebranding and saying, all right, cool, we rebranded the business. Like if you were with, I don't know, I'm gonna, random company that came into my head, Fastenal, you know, they do nuts and bolts and all those kinds of things. You know, you're not just rebranding Fastenal, and then going, okay, we're gonna go back to selling nuts and bolts. You're nuts and bolts are exactly what you just did.

The branding and the rebranding and the marketing. So, how did that process impact what you now do at SPCSHP?

Lizz Behler: We definitely have much more clarity on what type of work we wanna do. For example, I know we started with websites. A lot of people still know us for websites, and we have an amazing, you know, network of partners now to achieve that, but we alone don't do websites. What we do is more storytelling. So when you come back to that empathy and connection, it's really storytelling through creative content is our primary. And so it's a little bit more narrow than it used to be, but for a very intentional reason if you're, you know, trying to do everything, you're not gonna do anything really, really well. And so there has to be that experimentation type mindset. But how do we bring focus to it to get even greater creativity? You know, I think about it as like limitation and compression drives new creativity. It's no different than limiting what we offer and how we approach creativity as a whole.

Chris Hill: I mean that, that definitely makes a lot of sense because you're, yeah, as you focus and as you find that space where you work best, like that's where you need to go. Trying to be everything to everybody is hard, and I'm sure even that transition was probably a bit of a challenge too, and may still be for all I know.

But outside of that, I noticed Chase Bank, I think y'all have done some work with recently. Are there any good examples of where you've been able to implement this, implement your new practice and your new thoughts and branding, so to speak?

Lizz Behler: So when we, on the other side of the branding, branding, repositioning, and I would still say, you know, change is something that we're still experiencing. I mean we can come back to this, but being acquired by MSQ introduced new change, and so we were already working through our own and that, you know, brought new, but as far as how this impacted, you know, what we do, what we've been able to accomplish since then is, you know, we've landed for new clients, I can't speak to all of them because we're not publically sharing that yet, but one of them that I will, we work Dairy Queen. No different than what we did for the branding. I was gonna, you know, give Cory Galster, he's our amazing designer who did our SPCSHP branding. He also, he and his team did the Dairy Queen system and identity.

So that same type of mindset and curiosity we directly applied there. The storytelling of how do we do that with paid and social for them. They were one of the first partners that we were really able to implement that focus on. Like I said, we have a few other. We're working with Dropbox is another one that I can mention.

There's one I'm super excited about but can't share just yet. I even, you know, tempted to seek some permissions this morning, but no, go. But, you know, what's nice about it is because of that focus, and because of how articulate we're able to be with who we are and what we offer, we saw immediate impact on, oh, I know how to work with you, when to work with you, which is a challenge for any agency. You know, when there's so many of like, what would I turn to you for? We're finding that more and more companies understand that more clearly than they ever have of what do I turn to SPCSHP for? And so that is a big benefit and a big impact, and it really helps us even now with how we fit within the overall MSQ network of what do we do and then when do we tap into our network.

Because a network is, you know, I'll call other SPCSHPs, even though they're not called SPCSHP.

Chris Hill: They're part of your fleet.

Lizz Behler: They're part of our fleet. Yeah.

Chris Hill: Your fleet of SPCSHPs. Yes. Awesome. Okay. Well that, that is definitely a really cool way to think about it and a cool way to think about what you all are doing there.

So one of the things I wanted to talk about today is we really get into things here, is just that challenge, I noticed that you said in your bio that you really enjoy creative problem solving. And I can already tell like these challenges and these things we've been brought are definitely huge examples of that.

But what does creative problem solving mean to you?

Lizz Behler: When I think about creative problem solving, it's the awareness that there are many right ways to a solution, and it's about finding the best solution for that circumstance, okay? And so whether that's for a particular brief that a client gives us. Which is interesting because I think that oftentimes we have, I'll call it like the negotiation with a client over a brief of what are you actually trying to solve?

You know, sometimes, you know, often when clients come to you and ask you like, this is what I need, you, like, paint in this box. You go, okay, but why? Right? What are we trying to do? And that's that moment of like. We, you know, are, we're accountable to impacting business. And so it's important that we ask that question, and that's part of the creative problem solving question.

It starts our process. It starts very early from that first moment of conversation, that first brief. So it's not just that creative output which is, you know, ultimately how it's represented in the world, but it starts there of like, if there is a unique business challenge, like when you look at Dairy Queen, which is, you know, they are known, and I mean like childhood love for Dairy Queen and soft serve there, but that's what they were known for and they've expanded their whole product plan.

How do you support a brand that's gone from, you know, years and years of being known for treats? To expand into other food, you know, like your chicken strips. Like how do you support them in that change and without losing your core base. And so to me, what a cool problem to solve, right?

Because well, who doesn't love both those things? I mean, so when I think about it, that's like in particular to a brand, there's also creative problem solving of like what to know about people today. I think that we're very interesting time where you can express and discover your identity in so many ways, and I think it's amazing. And ultimately, identity is core to who we are as individuals, but it's also, you know, we talk about connection. Identity is what brings people together. It's how communities form because of some similar, you know, aspect of their identity or beliefs or, you know, even just interests. Like, "Hey, I love ceilings," so I surround myself with people that love it too.

So, all of those things are considerations for how you creatively problem solve. There's no kind of two similar problems. The the notion, even the word like creative. What does it mean to be creative? Every single field everywhere requires a level of creativity. I mean, there was a moment of time in my life where I thought I was gonna go into law, and that's because I found the constraints and the deep understanding so interesting, and to be a really exceptional lawyer, you have to know all the those things, but you have to work in and around them, so to speak, and that's creative problem solving within legal system. To me, that type of mindset of what do I need to know to really understand then am I working in it or am I working around it?

Chris Hill: Where my head goes with this is thinking about people that come and say, "Hey, I want to do X," and it's something that's very generic or very stereotypical. I use the example all the time here on We Built This Brand about going viral. You know, you hear people say, "I want to go viral." Okay, what does that mean?

What does that viral video do for you? Like what, what do you really benefit from doing that? Or, like, you know, for my company, HumblePod, we do podcast production. People want to, you know, get advertisers. And I'm like, yeah, but is that really what you need for your business? Or do you need revenue coming in?

Do you need to find a way to use this to position your brand better? Like what is the real benefit of this for you? And I think that, you know, starting with those questions is always really helpful 'cause sometimes you weed clients out there too, but but that's also a really good time to start.

That's where the creative part starts is figuring out what that first question you need to answer is, which is what is going to help you or help the client be the most successful that they can be. What are, how are they gonna walk away feeling like it was a success? And that's where I always start anyway, so that, that's really cool.

You know, I was gonna ask you like, how do you use that? How do you use creative problem solving in your day-to-day work? And it sounds like you've kind of answered that a lot, but I'd love to hear more about that too 'cause I'm sure there's more.

Lizz Behler: It's so, it's interesting, there's, you know, my day-to-day is different in the sense that I'm working on the business of SPCSHP and in the business of SPCSHP. And so you have different types of problems that you're trying to solve. Like, when you're working, you know, on the business and you're supporting teams and mentoring teams and supporting growth, your creative problem solve might be, gosh, I really see, you know, this individual is so strong at this, and I wanna see them grow. What is that thing that I can introduce that might make them a little bit uncomfortable, but start to challenge them so that they, you ignite that growth? That's creative problem solving within, you know, people management and because, you know, people are the most valuable asset of any company.

So I view that as like one of the most powerful and, you know, should be focused on problems to creatively solve is how do you keep people, you know, continuously growing within the business? You know, I brought up Dairy Queen, and I wanna bring up my other client, but I can't yet. They Oh yeah, I know.

Trust me. It's such an interesting new industry and there's so many constraints that make it very creatively challenging in the fun way. Where are you trying to go from a business standpoint? You know, I love reading quarterly business reports and financial reports because you start to understand not just the state of the business that you are working on, but how that's impacting the whole.

And maybe things that you weren't previously considering. Within Chase, the interesting thing you brought, you asked about them earlier. We've been a partner with for over seven years, and we continue to work with them on a project basis when we're AOR with many other clients, but with Chase, It's a new problem that they bring us to solve, and they don't always come with that, you know, here specifically, check this box, do this. But now they're coming to us as advisors. I'm like, how might we solve this together? And so it's been an interesting evolution of our relationship. And honestly, that's how most of our relationships started with SPCSHP. Even when we were Big Spaceship, I know you've probably seen that we were Starbucks partner for, you know, agency of record for many, many years.

That started with a project. And that project grew into an amazing relationship, a trusted relationship ultimately is business changes, you know, needs change. and that sense, that departure at about, you know, that nine year mark. But it's amazing to see that type of trust of like, I don't know exactly how to solve this, but like, we're gonna introduce this new product.

How should we launch it? These types of consumers, how do we do that? They're all unique and super, super interesting and you know, you're gonna approach each of those a little bit differently.

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Chris Hill: So you mentioned keeping employees growing and inspired. What do you do? How do you help your employees grow and stay inspired? Because in a creative agency, I think it's easy to get burned out on the day in, day out, you know, rote, "Okay, we gotta make sure the social posts go out. We gotta make sure this content gets out there, and that we have everything drafted by five o'clock or they're not gonna see it, and it won't get out," and all those anxieties. So how, how do you keep your team growing and inspired.

Lizz Behler: In the ideal circumstance you have more space for that. I would say right now, there's a lot of interesting demands happening in marketing that are making it more and more difficult, so I do wanna recognize that, but one of the things that I've done with almost every team, it's a little bit more difficult during, you know, with remote working, but at the end of every year, in order to like kick off the new year, one of the things that I've historically done is I've found a book for every individual on my team. And that book is not the same book. It's not like, you know, go out and read "Culture Code," which you should if you haven't, but it's, you might like "Secret Life of Colors" because that explores the depth of color and color theory and psychology or whatever. Or there's something unique about that in the sense that I need to know someone who they are as an individual. Like what makes them tick, what things are happening in their lives too, and how do I give them something kind of meets where they, while also potentially inspiring them. I use that example because It's kind of that once a year, I have to admit, the past years it has not been something I've been able to do. It's been very difficult. Remote working and with our kind of our team distributed, but within SPCSHP, a lot of that comes down to really listening.

Like to inspire someone, I'll give you this example. An amazing researcher and analyst on our team being bogged down by pulling data, and I was like, well, what if we find a way to automate that? And we're working within our MSQ partner now and MSQ data and they're building us a tool. And what I love about that is now on the other side of that tool being built, she will be able to do what she needs to do to fulfill like those client needs, but also she'll be able to spend that time thinking more around it. And so it's making the space for it. I think that's probably the biggest challenge right now is trying to wedge that space for people so that they can be inspired by the individuals within the company, but also on their own. So, I would say that's a transition that we're going through as a whole is trying to wedge those small moments of it, but those are just a couple examples, hopefully that.

Chris Hill: No, that's really good. I think the books, It's a very personal thing to pick an individual book for an individual and say, "This is the book for you," as opposed to, "Alright, this is the theme for the year. We bought 15 copies of Mark Schafer's latest marketing book," and there you go.

I think that means that probably means a lot to those individuals when you're able to do that, and then keeping people growing and inspired is always gonna be a challenge in finding, helping them find that space.

What do you do yourself to stay growing and inspired?

Lizz Behler: It's an interesting thing for me because I, gosh, I was talking to my husband about this the other day. I used to, every day I'd wake up, I'd read so much information, so much content. I still am an avid reader. I mean, I've read. 12 books this year, we're in April. I'm trying to break some records from last year, but that's one way.

But the other thing is I also have children and I'm kind of rediscovering the world through them. And so, you know, things like last night I sat down, and they're playing Animal Crossing and they wanna, you know, redesign things. For me, I was like, oh, why is this like that? Oh, why? You know, it's inspiring because I'm seeing the world through a different lens. Like I am not a 10 or 12-year-old child, you know, but I am experiencing what they're experiencing and I'm asking questions and I'm listening, and it's like they have their own little language. They have their own like culture that they've created even with each other.

And I think that's interesting because you know how that applies directly to what I do professionally. This morning I was having a conversation putting together a pitch with a few other crew members, and some of the things that came up in conversation with my daughters inspired me to go down some research rabbit holes. And those research rabbit holes are directly reflected in some of the content that we're now creating for the pitch. And so not how I thought I would end up there, but by being kind of like open in that sense, it allowed me to be led there.

Chris Hill: Yeah, kids are definitely a big inspiration. I have kids too, and yeah, definitely always learning something even from them or finding out what little world they're in, you know, and having to be plugged into that content, forcibly a lot of times. Alright we're watching, you know, five hours of Bluey today.

Okay, well that'll be fun. Rainy days are the best. What can I say? But yeah, so like, you know, things like that really help and then just rediscovering your own ability to play, I think, a lot of times too with kids and having to play by their roles and be creative again, it's yeah, definitely an inspiration source.

So that's great. That's great. And reading too. Do you, do you have a specific topic of books that you try to read through, or is it just, "Hey, I keep reading up. It's kinda like lifting weights. It's just what I like to continue to do and consume. "

Lizz Behler: I found last year was an interesting challenge I made for myself. So I started, my husband heavily influenced me, and I tried to start my year by setting goals. And last year, one of my goals was to read at least a book a month because I had fallen off my pace. And the reason I did that was just to try to get my speed up because I used to read many, many more research reports and in former jobs, and so I was like, alright, how do I get that speed back to where it should be? And then now It's more, it's fiction. It's nonfiction. Like right now I'm reading a parenting book because, you know, you can, I think always learn something new. I have two girls getting ready to go through, you know, some major hormone shifts.

I was like, God, help me. You know? So it really depends on what I'm trying to learn. You know, if I'm just trying to read a book because I'm in, you know, I'm in two book clubs, right? And so I'm like, well. I'm gonna read this non, or this fiction book so that I can be part of that community. That is a different intent than I'm gonna read this book so that I can better understand like all the crazy things that are ahead of me with these girls as they start to develop.

So it's usually pretty intentional in how I'm going and picking. But then what I love is people recommend books to me all the time and I have like a little cue and good reads and it's one of my favorite things. It's like, oh, I dunno if I'm gonna read that or not as well. I do wanna read. I'm saying this now.

It's like accountability because I'm saying it out loud.

Chris Hill: Alright, let's hear it.

Lizz Behler: I wanna read Dune. So my husband read Dune, and I bought him this amazing edition of it, and I was like, wow. It came in, I was like, this is heavy. I loved Dune. Watched it on a repeat, like, wow, what amazingly beautiful story.

Thinking about when it was written. I was like, I need to actually get back to the text and read it, you know, versus just watching it. But I find it really intimidating, and honestly it's because it's such a heavy weighted book, not just the content. But I also feel like that's part of the experience. So some books I might read on Kindle.

That one I need to read cover to cover in an actual tangible book. I think that's part of the experience. So, we'll see. I don't know if that'll be a this year thing, but maybe I'm ramping up for it for next year.

Chris Hill: So I did the audiobook of Dune before I watched the movie 'cause I had never done the books at all, and I delayed on the movie. 'cause I didn't have a ton of my, like I have friends that like it, but nobody was like, "Hey, come to the movie with me." So I was like, okay, I'll just wait and do whenever, and it's, yeah, it's intimidating but it's really good. There's a lot of depth in that book and for what it's worth, the audio book's actually really good, although I probably read it first if you're at that level where you've seen the movie multiple times, but very true to the movie. I will say at least the first book and yeah. That's really neat. Yeah. Books are, I'm reading more right now 'cause, I finally decided my son is six, and so I decided he needs to like start, I need to start him on some more advanced reading, and so I just dove right into the Hobbit with him. And that's been a really fun experience reading that 'cause now I'm reading that out loud, and that is a challenge. That is, oh my gosh, but it is, it has been a lot of fun. So yeah. Big reader. I enjoy reading. So I was just curious kinda where your, where your head was at with that. That's awesome. Okay. Well, yeah. So what,

just broadly speaking now, let's kinda widen out a little bit. What is top of mind for you in your industry right now?

What things are you thinking about and anticipating maybe for all your clients in the coming year?

Lizz Behler: Right now, I find there's such a focus on, I'm gonna separate content from storytelling. There's such a focus on content. The things, right? The actual and the volume of it, and when I think about not just, you know, SPCSHP, but just as a whole, what are the stories that you need to tell?

And I think about stories in a couple ways because oftentimes when you hear marketing, you think about, oh, that advertising, you know, that piece of advertising I saw, you know, while I was watching Netflix or while I was flipping through social media. But marketing, really, really good marketing, is also about understanding what consumers need, want, maybe don't know, right? And introducing products. So when I think about some of the greatest opportunities on the horizon right now is working with brands that really wanna understand their consumers, but also working with their development team, their product development team to start to create and fulfill those things, and then market it, and you know what you would consider that traditional way of marketing, but that to me is like the real opportunity. I mean, there's so much just stuff in the world. Like I don't even know the numbers anymore. I used to keep track of like how many, you know, brands do we see in a day, can't even keep track anymore.

And so when I think about the next, you know, three, five years for brands is really dialing in on what will be most meaningful to the consumers that I'm trying to connect with, rather than think about it as a volume approach, which is a really difficult shift for a lot of brands to make. I would say more so legacy brands, but you see some of these newer brands, and I know you're gonna come to, you know, one of my favorite brands, as of late, which I'll come to in a minute, but they're more nimble. They test, they experiment, and that is a hard mindset for a legacy brand to often adapt, and not all, I don't, you know, you can't throw a blanket statement out there, but it's one of those things like, I would love to work with more of those brands that are just open, like this is gonna be really ugly and really painful because of change, and we've been around for however many years, but that type of nimbleness in experimentation and know that not everything is going to be the most successful thing, but that mindset shift is what most brands should be focused on and what brand partners should be focused on.

Chris Hill: Yeah. Yeah, I think that speaks a lot to just the fragmentation of the internet as it is right now, because, you know, one thing that we're seeing a lot of is you, like, it's hard to be on one platform or to do one thing to many platforms, like the same piece of content that we may put on YouTube for YouTube short, even for this episode, maybe what I'm talking about right now will make it really meta, if our editors catch this, but you know, like this might perform well on YouTube shorts, and it might not perform as well on TikTok, and the content and the way you communicate on one platform isn't the way you communicate on another. And so that whole challenge of like, how are you. Creating your content and how are you being intentional with your content for the audience you're trying to reach is a big challenge.

And yeah, you gotta be willing to take a risk and go, you know, we may not have a big audience for this. Like, I always try to set the expectation with people on podcasting. You may not become famous overnight. Podcasting is a marathon. I mean, true podcasting, unless you have, you know, unless you're able to have like Kevin Hart as your host for the episode or the show, you're not going to come outta the gate swinging with thousands of downloads, and you need to be willing to understand what your alternative strategy is here and what you're gonna get out of it, because it still may be just as valuable in the end, but you don't, if you are just looking at the large number and not seeing it, you may not get that right off hand.

So yeah, totally, totally a big challenge, in the industry. So yeah, I would love to hear more about this experimentation and things that are being tried 'cause there's all kinds of stuff right now that are, things that are happening around us. And I know everybody talks about AI. I don't want to go into too much detail on that 'cause I feel like that's talked about ad naseum on other shows, but even some of the creativity that I'm seeing in that industry right now is really impressive. Some stuff that I'm seeing is like, okay, this is scary. It's not coming for my job, but it is wild what people are able to do with it. So yeah. So that's very cool. That's very cool. So yeah,

You alluded to it, so I'll just go ahead and ask. Last question I always like to ask on this podcast is, you know, what brand do you admire the most right now? And I'd just love to hear from you, like, what brand is that? I know you were excited to talk about it, so let's dive in.

Lizz Behler: Well, I laugh because it's a brand that sits in my fridge, and it kind of warmed its way in there, but it's poppi, and it's not, you know, I look at their latest news of being, you know, acquired by Pepsi, and I'm like, amazing.

Good for you. But the thing that I love is how they started. So they were what Mother Beverage, I think is what they were called. There is, you know, two young women that started. One, they kind of stumbled into this area because of some health issues, right? And so those health issues led to the product development of something that would be better for your overall gut health.

Not something you think about when you think about, you know, a can sitting in your fridge is like, oh, I'm gonna drink this thing, and it's gonna impact my gut health. I also think it's really, really cool that, you know, they went on Shark Tank, and that, like a lot of people don't know because they were still under Mother Beverage, you know, and they secured this deal with a beverage industry expert like, and it just exploded from there. They went into rebrand. That was 2020, and all of a sudden 2020 on, you're like, "poppi, like yeah! That fizzy pop-like drink that's sitting in my fridge," like it's just the packaging and design. Their whole brand story, it's so well crafted, and then how they continue to double down. You know, they find those right influencers. It's not just about getting, you know, a can of poppi in their hands, right? Like when they went out and created, you know, custom sweatsuits for, you know, influencers. They, they're thinking about beyond the product, beyond the liquid that's sitting in that can.

And so I'm not surprised that they were bought by Pepsi, and I'm like, that's why I got, I saw that news. I was like, good for you. You created something before because you were seeking your own benefit, right? You needed to think about your own gut health, and you've now shared that with the world, and now it like Pepsi's adding it to the overall portfolio.

To me it started with something like a positive intention. I say the word intention a lot, it's just my 20-something years of yoga practice showing, but they did that and they continued to show up that way as a brand and continued to double down on their identity and the value that they bring to people, the personality, the type of life they wanna live, and I think that's why they're seeing the success that they're seeing. So it was kind of an easy question, staring that can face every day, and it's just like, it's beautiful. So.

Chris Hill: Now you're making me thirsty. Oh, I have a little bit of coffee left, so that'll do for now, but now I'm craving something carbonated. But yeah, no, that's, poppi's a cool brand. I've only had a little bit of experience with the brand or at least, you know, buying the drinks, but they are good. I have enjoyed it, and I've found myself going more for alternatives to soda and even beer and things like that have, I don't know. I would say it's partially the pandemic, partially some personal stuff that I won't get into on the podcast, but I haven't been drinking as much, and that's ironic if you know my history, which was a craft beer podcast prior to this one. So I very much understand when I hear you go, "Yay, go Pepsi," I'm like, that is so antithetical to everything in the craft beer industry where they're like, "Oh man, you got inquired by Anheuser-Busch. Well, screw you. We're not buying your beer anymore."

Lizz Behler: I think my, "Yay, go Pepsi," was more "Yeah!" for the founders of like, you know, I think it's funny because I don't even drink soda. I mean, that's like such a rarity and so the fact that I'm drinking poppi is kind of off-brand for me a little bit personally, but, you know, it's yeah, I can definitely see how like in the craft beer space. My dad and I used to brew beer, and that was just for us, you know, like I don't know when to get to our German roots and understand how do we actually make really, really good beer. Really, it smells horrible making it, but, you know, tasty on the otherside. But yeah, it's interesting to see small indie brand, that's what I viewed poppi as, you know, formerly, you know, Mother Beverage. And that success, and I always, you know, you think about how many small businesses fail and how many experiments fail, and so it's this kind of rally in my mind to push for that curiosity, that experimentation, and know that like, yeah, for every failure or every few failures, there's still those wins.

And that's, you know, what it means to me. When I was like, oh yeah, poppi all the way.

Chris Hill: Yeah, no, and that's, and that's great. And I'm not trying to downplay them to be clear, like being acquired by Pepsi. 'cause like I saw that in the beer industry. My over time, my observation was that most of the people that start a brewery, and I don't know how true this is where you're at up around Detroit, but in our area, we have a lot of people that are like in their forties and fifties that have been in a craft beer for a long time, that all of a sudden start to brew, and they home brew, and then they go out and they become a commercial brewer. And like, that transition is always, almost always someone with an engineering background. You know, someone who's had a previous career, and they've built that, and then all of a sudden they build something that somebody wants, and they wanna buy?

That's their ticket outta retirement. There are millions of dollars in the hole for this equipment, and then they get to sell it all and make money back. I mean, good for them. Like, I don't begrudge anybody for that anymore, but like, it definitely, you know, there's always the, just the concern about, oh, is the quality gonna go down?

Are they gonna change the recipe? Are they gonna, you know, what are they gonna do? But for the most part, you know, that's not been an issue. And I'm sure it won't be for poppi. So.

Lizz Behler: And I don't know a year from now, right? We dunno.

Chris Hill: We dunno. We dunno. They could, they could be adding in high fructose corn syrup, and, you know.

No, I'm kidding. That would be, I mean, yeah, I'm trying to avoid it as well. I actually prefer, like, if I buy Coke, I try to buy the Mexican Coke. You know, the one with the real cane sugar and stuff like that in it, when I buy. But yeah, that's cool. But yeah, That's great. So poppi's a poppi's a cool brand.

Well, great.

Well, where can people connect with you and, and learn more about SPCSHP?

Lizz Behler: Well, people can connect with me on LinkedIn. Lizz Behler. SPCSHP is also there. Or SPCSHP, no vowels, .com. You can also connect with some of our crew members through the website there.

You'll find us in all social media channels.

Chris Hill: Awesome. Well, Lizz, thank you so much for coming on. We Built This Brand. It's been a pleasure to have you today.

Lizz Behler: Thank you, Chris.

Chris Hill: Thanks for checking out this episode of We Built This Brand. Don't forget to like, follow, and subscribe on your player of choice. You can keep up with the podcast on our website at webuiltthisbrand.com.

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